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Back again-with some mastered copies of Django

PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 12:34 am
by Notorious
It's been a while since I've been on here. Since I've been here though, I've really been getting heavy into recording and I started listening to Django again (I had listened to him exclusively for 2 years). I realized obviously that those old recordings really needed some mastering and nobody was doing it right. Either you could barely hear Grappelli or Django, and there was always the hiss of the record on every recording. So I took it upon myself to start mastering these classics because I love the man dearly and would hate for my children (when I have them) to not be able to understand the beauty and intelligence behind Django.

Here's one of my favorites with the group with Louis Jordan singing. Let me know what you guys think. Maybe I'll start mastering all of them (I have his entire works).

PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:31 am
by Teddy Dupont
That sounded pretty good to me. I would have to compare it with my various copies of that particular recording to be sure. By the way it is Freddy Taylor singing not Louis Jordan.

I would very much like to see what you could do with the two 1935 versions of "Chinatown" and the 1938 "Why Shouldn't I?".

As requested, Why Shouldn't I?

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:49 am
by Notorious
Well, I just mastered "Why Shouldn't I?" Teddy, would you happen to know who recorded this session because it seemed like they were using one mic to record both Django and Grappelli, or it may have been the old technique like they did with Armstrong of having Grappelli in the other room. It's weird because when I turn up the highs on the graphic eq, they are both on the same band. Anyway, I'll still be fixing it up a bit but here's what I have so far in just a few minutes of editing.

PS. I knew that wasn't Louis Jordan, I was testing you.

Re: As requested, Why Shouldn't I?

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:50 am
by nwilkins
Notorious wrote:it seemed like they were using one mic to record both Django and Grappelli


isn't that the way most sessions went? Everyone gathered around one mic?

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 9:28 am
by Notorious
Not necessarily. In some instances, they would have guys record in another room because they were so loud (Louis Armstrong did this quite a bit in his early instrumental days.) There were other techniques but you can really tell how they recorded it and really see how long things have come in so little time.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:10 am
by Teddy Dupont
I could not get the "Why Shouldn't I" to work on my computer for some reason. :cry:

There is no doubt that the HCQ always recorded as a group sitting round one or two microphones. "Why Shouldn't I" was recorded in London at the Decca studios in Broadhurst Gardens. Below is a photo of them at another Decca studio (Upper Thames Street) earlier in 1938 which shows two mics.......You might try "Flat Foot Floogie" and "Lambeth Walk" to see if the mic set-up sounds the same.

The second photo (wrongly titled) shows the 1946 recording session at Abbey Road with Django clearly having his own mic.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:08 pm
by nwilkins
Notorious wrote:Not necessarily. In some instances, they would have guys record in another room because they were so loud (Louis Armstrong did this quite a bit in his early instrumental days.)


I meant most of the HCQ sessions with Grappelli.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:47 pm
by zorab
Django in Rome box set is a total farce the way it was remastered, The volume is low and sounds bad

Let's try this again

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:36 am
by Notorious
I'm going to try putting the new copy on the site again. I got as much of the hiss out as possible. There's only so much that can be done without having been in the room.

As to mastering, I don't think I've ever heard any of the albums mastered well. It seems to me a nobrainer would have been to take the static out of the recording but maybe some people like that? Maybe it adds a level of mystique and antiquity to the recording?

Thanks for the pics, Teddy.

Let me know how this one sounds.

Anyway, off to a gig.

Re: Let's try this again

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:13 am
by Cuimean
Notorious wrote:As to mastering, I don't think I've ever heard any of the albums mastered well. It seems to me a nobrainer would have been to take the static out of the recording but maybe some people like that? Maybe it adds a level of mystique and antiquity to the recording?


I'm not an engineer so I can't answer this definitively, but I believe some historians and audiophiles feel that removing the hiss also removes too much of the high end present in the instruments on the recordings. I've heard a remastered version of Baro Ferret playing "La Folle" and a recording of the same tune taken directly from the original record, and I feel that while the direct, un-remastered recording is certainly noisier, it also reveals more of the bite in Baro's guitar playing.

I dunno...some of the trade-offs are worth it sometimes. I mean, I'm all for film restoration experts using computers to remove scratches from rare, deteriorating films...I'm just personally not too into revisionist re-editing and George Lucas-style additions.

I think I meant that to relate to the topic of re-mastering old recordings, but I'm too tired to work out the rest of the analogy. If you can find some meaning there, congrats. I'm going to bed.

Re: Let's try this again

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:33 am
by Notorious
I'm not an engineer so I can't answer this definitively, but I believe some historians and audiophiles feel that removing the hiss also removes too much of the high end present in the instruments on the recordings. I've heard a remastered version of Baro Ferret playing "La Folle" and a recording of the same tune taken directly from the original record, and I feel that while the direct, un-remastered recording is certainly noisier, it also reveals more of the bite in Baro's guitar playing.


This is exactly what I thought as well, yet so long as we keep mastering tasteful, I think it allows those after us to understand and hear what these masters were doing and why it's of importance.[/quote]

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 10:58 am
by Teddy Dupont
I still cannot get "Why Shouldn't I" to play on my computer. Can anyone else? "After You've Gone" works fine.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:56 am
by Cattermole
Teddy Dupont wrote:I still cannot get "Why Shouldn't I" to play on my computer. Can anyone else?


I can't.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 2:52 pm
by nwilkins
me neither

PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 7:45 pm
by Notorious
That's weird because I'm doing everything that I did with After You've Gone and it's not working. Is Zoot still around? Maybe we can get the problem fixed.