All recordings of Django in mp3 on the web

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Would you like an mp3 database with all Django records on this website

yes
14
56%
no
11
44%
 
Total votes : 25

All recordings of Django in mp3 on the web

Postby Plectrum » Fri Apr 23, 2004 8:58 pm

For some time now I have this idea to build a webdatabase with all the recordings of Django

... it is gone now, wasn't such a great idea altogether


cheers!
Last edited by Plectrum on Thu Jan 22, 2015 1:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby djangology » Fri Apr 23, 2004 10:24 pm

i had no idea that this sort of thing would be legal.

in the US, copyright law says:

Duration of Copyright
The duration of copyright has changed several times as Congress refined compromises over the law. Currently, a teacher can generally presume that a work copyrighted less than 95 years ago is still covered by the law. Here are how the details work:

Works created after January 1, 1978 will be protected for the life of the composer (author) plus 70 years.
Copyrights in effect on that date, if renewed, will continue for 95 years from the date copyright was originally secured. Renewal became automatic for all works that first obtained US copyright in 1964 or later, so those works in their initial 28-year period of copyright on January 1, 1978 could have been or now can be renewed for an additional 67 years, while the copyright of works in their renewal term on that date were automatically extended for an additional 19 years, and, if still in copyright on October 28, 1998, again for an additional 20 years, for a total of 39.

Since Djangos recordings were all originally marked before 1964, I am not sure what legal state they are in, does anyone else? This is an interesting statement: Any copyright, the first term of which is subsisting on January 1, 1978, shall endure for 28 years from the date it was originally secured. This would imply that it all becomes freely available all at once in the year 2006.
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Postby Meshugy » Fri Apr 23, 2004 10:46 pm

I deal with this all the time: Compositions from 1906-1950, if renewed, are protected for 95 years. In my exeprience, all of Django's stuff was renewed so his recordings and compositions are protected.

This is US law....not sure how it works in Europe. My guess is that his stuff won't be PD in Europe any time soon....

-Michael

DjangoBooks.com
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Postby djangology » Fri Apr 23, 2004 11:00 pm

your pretty much right sorta. for the recordings from 1950-1953 the initial copyright would have expired after 1978 and so the expiration years would be 95 in those cases. making the last year of copyright 2047-2050 or something.

1. before 1978 copyrights lasted 28 years and could be renewed for another 28.
2. after 1978 you tack on another 67 AFTER the first or second 28 period expires. therefore you have a potential for copyright to last as long as 2067 for Django?

example1: Django copyrights a tune in 1924. he renews the copyright in 1952 for 28 more years. 1978 law passed. in 1980 his estate renews it for 67 more years and it lasts until 2047.

example2: Django copyrights a tune in 1918. he renews it in 1946 for another 28 years. his estate renews the second time in 1974 for 28 years but this happens before 1978. it expires in 2002?

example3: Django copyrights a tune in 1940. he renews in 1968 for 28 more years. his estate renews in 1996 for 67 more years and it expires in 2063??

all confused. anybody better at math than me? it probably wouldn't be too hard to make a graph of the most likely expiration dates.

-------------
Works Originally Created and Published or Registered Before January 1, 1978: This is governed by statutory section 17 USC 304. Under the law in effect before 1978, copyright was secured either on the date a work was published or on the date of registration if the work was registered in unpublished form. In either case, the copyright endured for a first term of 28 years from the date it was secured. During the last (28th) year of the first term, the copyright was eligible for a second renewal term of an additional 28 years. If no application was filed for renewal, the work would enter the public domain after the initial 28 year term.

The current copyright law has extended the renewal term from 28 to 67 years for copyrights that existed as of January 1, 1978, making these works eligible for a total term of protection of 95 years. There is no longer a need to make the renewal filing in order to extend the original 28-year copyright term to the full 95 years. However, some benefits accrue to making a renewal registration during the 28th year of the original term.

In other words, if a work was published between 1923 to 1963, the copyright owner was required to have applied for a renewal term with the Copyright office. If they did not, the copyright expired and the work entered into the public domain. If they did apply for renewal, these works will have a 95 year copyright term and hence will enter into the public domain no sooner that 2018 (95 years from 1923). If the work was published between 1964 to 1977, there is no need to file for a renewal, and these works will automatically have a 95 year term.
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Postby Plectrum » Sat Apr 24, 2004 2:12 pm

The us copyright law as mentioned here is applicable to written compostions and not with respect to recorded music. In Europe copyright on recorded music expires after 50 years. That is why you see so many CDs of Django and Jazz-contemporaries; all the music is free available to the record companies. However what is protected is the CD itself: you are not allowed to copy and distributed protectde CD's. But the recording itself is free of copyright.
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Postby Meshugy » Sat Apr 24, 2004 5:44 pm

Plectrum wrote:The us copyright law as mentioned here is applicable to written compostions and not with respect to recorded music. In Europe copyright on recorded music expires after 50 years. That is why you see so many CDs of Django and Jazz-contemporaries; all the music is free available to the record companies. However what is protected is the CD itself: you are not allowed to copy and distributed protectde CD's. But the recording itself is free of copyright.


but since the compositions are protected you would still have to pay Harry Fox for mechanical licenses.

-Michael

DjangoBooks.com
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Postby nwilkins » Sat Apr 24, 2004 5:52 pm

yeah - the recordings themselves may not be subject to copyright but the songs still are :)
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Postby Plowboy » Sun Apr 25, 2004 3:03 am

Not totally familiar with the in's and out's of copyright laws, but, at least in the US, I know that performances can also be protected--even someones performance of PD material.
Such a protection is indicated on CD's and the like as an encircled "P", much like the encircled "C" showing copyright protection. (Check your CD's to see what I mean.)
Might be another consideration for you, Plectrum. Keep us posted. Interesting concept.

BTW--Just checked some of my Uncle Dave Macon recordings who started performing professionally and died about the same time as Django. He did a LOT of PD and stuff he ripped off from various sources.
The CD's still have the circle "C" and circle "P".
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Postby jero » Sun Apr 25, 2004 10:07 am

Incidentally, in '98 the U.S. Congress approved a bill legislating an even further extension of copyright longivity. And this bill was drafted by none other than the late Sonny Bono!
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Postby stublag » Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:41 pm

Surely the whole idea of free MP3's of all Djangos recordings undermines the incredibly important work of the Integrale series;why should the Fremeaux guys spend countless hours researching and producing that historic series if their sales are cancelled out by people who know 0% about the subject blithely uploading other peoples hard work?
It would be wrong.
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Postby devinci » Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:53 pm

I agree with Stublag, I think it is morally incorect.
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Postby nwilkins » Sun Apr 25, 2004 4:31 pm

jero wrote:Incidentally, in '98 the U.S. Congress approved a bill legislating an even further extension of copyright longivity. And this bill was drafted by none other than the late Sonny Bono!


Thank you Jero, Knower of Oddities :wink:
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Postby TedGottsegen » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:50 pm

I think that this is flat out WRONG to do. Yes, I trade mp3's, but only out of print material from the original vinyl - or personal live recordings. Django's family gets royalties for every CD sold and I know that I would hate to take money out of their pockets. What a great way of being appreciative for all the music by taking money away from Django's descendents!

Being a musician, I know how hard it is to make any decent money playing. Having many friends in the music business, I know how much effort they put into their product and it's a such a waste when people simply make copies for friends for free.

Plectrum - what do you do for a living? Imagine showing up for work one day and having your boss look at you and say "You know what? We're not going to need you this week, we got someone else to do the work instead." Have some scruples and take the site down.
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Don't worry

Postby fmason » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:51 pm

I personally like the fact that I can hear music without buying it from whoever happens to control the copyright at any given moment. As far as piracy, I wouldn't worry. This guy has some of the worst quality mp3s I've ever heard on his site... I already have a headache and I've only listened to one song!
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Re: Don't worry

Postby TedGottsegen » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:54 pm

fmason wrote:I personally like the fact that I can hear music without buying it from whoever happens to control the copyright at any given moment.


Than listen to clips at towerrecords.com, towerrecords.co.uk, fnac.com, amazon.fr, amazon.de, amazon.com or any number of online retail outlets - some people don't care about quality...the fact that they are available at all is wrong.
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